Islam Rising

Mark Steyn, Pat Buchanan and others have been talking about this in books the past few years, but here is a video summary. These predictions are always based on the assumption that current trends will continue for the next 20 years, which they almost never do. Still, the Muslim influence in Europe influence is enough to frighten anyone who actually knows what is is be western–since those who do are so few, it isn’t surprising that our culture is being taken over.

4 Comments Islam Rising

  1. Rachel

    I am not impressed by the video. Two examples:

    Example 1:

    I do not know all the numbers, but I do know that the figures for the Netherlands are completely rubbish.

    Video: in 15 years half of the population will be muslim

    Official numbers from the Dutch government, based on the assumption current trends will continue and ignoring recent signs that the growth of the muslim population might decline: 2050: 8.3% of the population will be muslim. http://www.nidi.knaw.nl/en/output/demos/2007/demos-23-09-debeer.pdf/demos-23-09-debeer.pdf

    This makes me wonder if we really should believe all the other “facts” given in this video.

    Example 2:

    Southern France traditionally one of the most populated church regions in the world?? Have they ever been there? Of course there are a lot of churches there, but they have often been vacant for decades. They are monuments or people only go there on special occasions. What do they mean with “churches”? Buildings actively used as churches, buildings that used to be used as church buildings and are now only the reminders of a once Christian world that faded away long before the arrival of all these immigrants?? And if they say there are more mosques then churches in southern France? What do they mean? Are they talking about the buildings? If that is the case I seriously doubt if there really are more mosques. I mean every village, no matter how small it is, it still has got its own church building. If they are talking about buildings actively used as a church or a mosque they might be right (I don’t have any numbers myself so I can’t check them). But that does not say much about the influence of muslims on society, but much more about the French who no longer go to church and about the growing number of young people who move away to the north for work etc. France is a very secular country, with more and more people leaving the country to try to find jobs in the big cities.

    Anyway…I am not saying Islam can not cause problems, however this video does not seem very trustworthy. I think secularism is a much bigger problem in Europe!

    Rachel

  2. jwowen

    Rachel,

    I’d love to interact with that website but my Dutch is a little rusty! The birthrates are accepted facts, though like you and I said, it’s a matter of how these will continue or not in the future.

    The point about France is that there used to be a high population of worshiping churches there. The fact that they’re vacant today is the whole point. The Christians, who generally run with “be fruitful and multiply,” are not there. Instead, the secularists inhabit the country and most of western Europe and currently they are not having children. Who is? The Muslims. So while secularists are running the place right now (and I agree are more of a problem at the moment), they won’t be for long if things continue like this. And the new problems generated by Islam will be worse; at least that’s the thought. Pat Buchanan’s The Death of the West is good on this, as is Mark Steyn’s more recent America Alone. I have no doubt there are more functioning “Mosques” in southern France whether they meet in homes or beneath crescent moons. Muslim community courts in the burbs of London and Archbishop Rowan William’s insane comments about recognizing Sharia law are signs that Islam in Britain is a force to be reckoned with as well. What about Theo Van Gogh and the Dutch media’s fear of offending Muslims? Doesn’t that reflect Islamic influence?

    I’m confident Muslims are immigrating and multiplying in western nations faster than we are. What I’m curious to see is whether they will be able maintain fundamentalist Islam or will essentially become secularists like so many of the former Christians have.

  3. Rachel

    Jerry,

    Well I would argue the rates given for the Netherlands are not accepted facts. The numbers given by the officially Dutch government organisation who is responsible for giving these rates give a very different numbers. They say that in a “worst case scenario” the muslim population will be 24,4 % of the population in 2050 (that is not within 15 years!!!). For that to happen:
    a. the birthrate of muslim population will have to get higher
    b. the number of muslims immigrating to the Netherlands will get higher
    In fact for both a. and b. the opposite is happening. Therefore they predict the muslim population will grow from 5% in 2006 to 8 in 2050. This government organisation is highly respected. Of course one can debate their interpretation of the rates, but still. Even if I do my own calculations it just seems ridicilous:

    Example:
    Amount of muslims in the Netherlands: ca. 875,000 (ca.5%)–> so probably about 437,500 women.
    Total inhabitans of the Netherlands: ca. 16,500,000 people
    The video says within 15 years 50% of the inhabitans of the Netherlands will be muslim.
    So lets say within 15 years there would be the same amount of inhabitans. That would mean 437,500 muslim women must have given birth to 7,425,000 muslim children. That means they must get about an average of 17 children within 15 years!! And yeah I am aware there are other things that might influence it all, like more Dutch people dying then getting born and immigration…but even that would mean a ridicilous high birth rate! Especially when you consider that a large percentage of the muslim women won’t have been able to get children because they are too old or still too young!

    The main problem in the Netherlands is one of poor muslim immigrants who do not seem to be able to get their own part in society. Their religion plays an important part in the problem – especially after 9/11 – but it is also a social problem. These fundamental kids – like the one who killed Theo van Gogh – use their religion to take action against a society that they think has looked down on them. It is not the only way they respond: Interesting enough I just heard how muslim people from the second and third generation are starting to move back to their “home countries”. At the moment there are more muslims leaving the country then coming in.

    As you I also think islam is a threat for our western society. I also see that the number of muslims in western countries is growing. It really annoys me how some Dutch media have no problem making fun of christians, but are scared to death to ‘insult’ muslims. I also see the dangers of radical islam!

    The video just is not very helpful. Because I know for a fact the numbers about given for the Netherlands are wrong I seriously doubt all the numbers and rates they are giving. Why mess up the figures? It only undermines their argument. There is no need!

    And well my point about Southern France. In the video they are suggesting that the fact there are more mosques then churches this tells us sometething about the growth of islam compared to western beliefs. In fact the decline of churches has not much to do with islam, but much more with a growing secularism. Yes there might be more mosques then churches,but that does not say a thing about society as a whole. The non muslim community might still be much bigger, but they just no longer go to church.

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